• Changetheview@lemmy.world
    692·
    1 year ago

    The worst part is that many of those who fall for this lie are some of the worst off, financially speaking. And they’re often surrounded by people in similar positions.

    They know they’re fucked. They’ll watch neighbors lose homes, avoid doctors, go through times when they can’t pay bills, etc.

    Then they’ll turn around and vote against their own interests. Against the interests of those they’re close to.

    Fucking wild that the propoganda machines are that powerful.

    • alterforlett @lemmy.world
      11·
      1 year ago

      I believe it works so well on those who are in a bad financial situation because whatever little money they make, they want to/need to keep as much of it as possible.

      That makes them an easy target of “we’re going to lower taxes.” While of course only doing it for the wealthy and screaming the left wants to give your hard earned money to lazy people, immigrants, sex changes or whatever marginalized group is the flavour of the year to attack.

    • psycho_driver@lemmy.world
      3·
      1 year ago

      None of this applies to me but the avoiding doctors part. Am I up in here with a bunch of multi millionaires or something?

      • Iron Lynx@lemmy.world
        9·
        1 year ago

        Probably a very American thing, the richest country in the world that, for some mad reason, never decided to offer single payer subsidised healthcare for all its residents.

  • Doctor xNo@r.nfEnglish
    296·
    1 year ago

    Am I the only one here who’s bothered by what really counts?

    Why is left standing right and right standing left?

    The universe makes no sense anymore!

  • paddirn@lemmy.worldEnglish
    20·
    1 year ago

    Honestly, they don’t even try to hide it. They flaunt their wealth and in between gorging themselves on the wealth of the people, they’ll spout out some inane BS to incense the masses.

  • MrSqueezles@lemm.ee
    111·
    1 year ago

    It’s the government that has all the rest of my your money. We have to cut taxes so I you can get more of it from you!

    • Changetheview@lemmy.world
      12·
      1 year ago

      I know your comment isn’t truly asking, but I want to answer just because there was a time when I used to put a lot of pressure on myself to generate something truly insightful, creative, deep, etc. before voicing my thoughts or opinion. Then I realized you don’t need to do that. I still have a tendency to - and I’m not saying everyone should just voice their loud-ass bullshit without thinking.

      You likely have an insight that someone would find interesting, even if it seems entirely obvious to you. Great conversation can sometimes be a very simple volley back and forth of extremely basic observations.

      Run with whatever logic this makes your mind go to… even if it’s something like “crazy that people vote to give rich people more money” or another basic interpretation of this. It gets the ball rolling for other people, let’s them put a new spin on it, and may be that little spark needed to create something more impactful.

    • FunkyMonk@kbin.social
      12·
      1 year ago

      Sure, now your out of the in group, because I say so, do my bidding serf. Complain more about the concept of ‘mine’ while we all burn. oh wait /s

  • nxfsi@lemmy.world
    1532·
    1 year ago

    I want to support leftism because their ideals are wonderful, but all the leftist groups I find are full of traitors that support Russia and China, despite the fact that those two countries are actually fascist instead of communist. What should I do?

        • flashgnash@lemm.ee
          63·
          1 year ago

          I think hexbears are mostly edgy teens though, not sure they represent actual left wing parties

        • OurToothbrush@lemmy.ml
          13·
          1 year ago

          The hexbear consensus isn’t to support Russia like the commenter above your comment is referring to though, a left wing revolution in Russia would be more than welcome. The humanitarian crisis caused by the undemocratic dissolution of the USSR is still being felt to this day through nationalism playing out in former soviet states.

    • KillAllPoorPeople@lemmy.worldEnglish
      182·
      1 year ago

      It sounds like you’re either a liar or completely mistaken. Since you seem to post a lot about politics, I’m leaning towards the former. You also spread a lot of bullshit like how affirmative action is the real racism, how your sexism is based in “objective facts”, how the opium wars started racism against Chinese people, etc.

      You’re just another clown trying to trash leftists by claiming to be one.

      • nxfsi@lemmy.world
        314·
        1 year ago

        And that demonstrates that all the leftist groups are not filled with Russia and China supporters… how? I speak out against “communist” governments because they are actually fascist in practice and go against the democratic distribution of power like Marx envisioned.

        • KillAllPoorPeople@lemmy.world
          10·
          1 year ago

          And that demonstrates that all the leftist groups are not filled with Russia and China supporters… how?

          Because it’s clear you’ve never talked to any leftist member of any leftist group ever?

          You’ve completely made up these big bad “Russia and China” supporting “leftists” in your head. Every leftist space I’ve ever seen in person is full to the brim of anarchists. You have to go out of your way to find these people you think are rampant in leftist circles. What you read online isn’t how it works in the real world. You need to get out more and stop believing all this anti-leftist propaganda you’re reading online.

    • antifa@lemmy.world
      15·
      1 year ago

      Think about it this way: just because a group claims to be socialist or leftist, doesn’t exempt them from being fascist. If they support fascism, they’re not leftist, no matter what they call themselves.

        • AngrilyEatingMuffins@kbin.social
          13·
          1 year ago

          Red fascism as a term originates with Trotsky, who, I’m fairly sure we can all agree, understood the difference between communism and fascism.

          • OurToothbrush@lemmy.ml
            23·
            1 year ago

            Mainstream Jewish holocaust survivors don’t like the comparison.

            https://jewishcurrents.org/the-double-genocide-theory

            Also Trotsky sure did a lot of anticommunism for a communist who (checks notes) only joined the communists when it was clear which way the wind was blowing in the summer of 1917 and got kicked out of the party and exiled by 80 percent of the party after several years of advocating for the petite bourgeoisie.

    • jennwiththesea@lemmy.world
      43·
      1 year ago

      Just find a local Democrat group, irl in your area. They likely won’t be as progressive as you want, but you can have a voice in the candidates and initiatives they endorse. They also won’t be tankies.

        • WaxedWookie@lemmy.world
          132·
          1 year ago

          While true, in the US, they’re the least bad option - you get them or the Republicans, unfortunately. If the fascists aren’t kept out of power, you’ll have an active slide toward democracy being dismantled and a series of genocides rather than stagnation and any hope of progress toward a leftist utopia. I really hate to say it, but vote blue, no matter who.

          That said, unions and union-adjustment groups are a good start for leftist (i.e. non-tankie) groups - they tend to be practical, and the idea of worker enfranchisement rather than autocracy tends to scare tankies away.

  • Kra@mtgzone.comEnglish
    430·
    1 year ago

    Truth is, both have it. Illegal immigrants cost a lot of money, the jobless (those who are too lazy to work, not the unfortunate ones) getting a lot of welfare and health care costs a lot of money, and the super rich not paying taxes and earning ridiculous and unethical amount of money also costs a lot of money. The most suffering people are people working hard every day, being able to afford less and less. But those are the people running the countries. They should be the ones having a sufficient amount of wealth. Now keep downvoting me for not endlessly repeating your far left propaganda in this echo chamber.

    • OurToothbrush@lemmy.ml
      236·
      1 year ago

      those who are too lazy to work

      What no understanding of the necessity of the surplus army of labor under capitalism does to a mfer.

    • Mo9000@lemmy.world
      122·
      1 year ago

      Please, do enlighten us on how the homeless and jobless cost a lot of money and then show us how much this impacts the national debt? You can then show us how much spending on those elements compares to other spending such as oh I don’t know military budgets. While you’re at it, why don’t you contextualize that in the case of currency sovereignty, and through modern monetary theory? You don’t have a clue what you’re talking about. You think national debt works like debt works for you and I but it doesn’t. If you don’t believe me how about listening to the the words of Dick Cheney - “Reagan proved deficits don’t matter”. It’s why the republicans present themselves as the ‘party of fiscal responsibility’ all the while running up record levels of national debt every time they are in power.

    • Black Comrade@lemmygrad.mlOP
      112·
      1 year ago

      “Now keep downvoting for sharing my ignorant, hateful and biggoted views. Gosh, one cannot be a bigot without being downvoted these days, specially on leftists communities. What happened to the good old days when one could be a bigot and hate on immigrants all day long without being called out for it!”

    • CriticalResist8@lemmygrad.ml
      81·
      1 year ago

      You have no idea how to balance a budget.

      “Hmm, candles cost me 1500$ a month. But on the other hand, I could save 200$ a month if I reduced my groceries. I need to save 1000$, clearly I’ll just stop buying groceries” that’s your solution lol

    • StorminNorman@lemmy.world
      92·
      1 year ago

      You could have literal millions more immigrants or social welfare recipients, tax the rich properly, and be able to afford it.

    • whenigrowup356@lemmy.worldEnglish
      51·
      1 year ago

      Costs associated with illegal immigration aren’t really all that clear cut, from what I’ve seen. Undocumented immigrants generate a lot of revenue and economic activity and pay a lot in taxes while not being able to use most government services.

      The major drag on revenues that I was able to find is on state/local governments that fund education for undocumented children, which should probably be remedied with more federal funding to offset.

      Tons of datapoints cited at the Wikipedia page on the subject

    • ReCursing@kbin.social
      2·
      1 year ago

      The phrase “a lot of money” means two very different things here. The difference in scale between illegal immigrants and the jobless, and the oligarchs, is so many orders of magnitude that’s the difference between them and you is near nothing. Billionaires are not just a little bit richer than you, they have more hoarded than you will make in your lifetime, while illegal immigrants and jobless are more than likely worse off than you and if they’re not you should be shouting to improve your lot not shouting to worsen theirs

      A quick google search shows that the total the UK spent on unemployment benefits last year was £1,860,000,000, and on illegal immigration cost £3,000,000,000. Meanwhile Rishi Sunak (our prime minister) and his wife are worth about £1,200,000,000 between them. The median net worth in the UK is apparently £302,500 - that means Sunak and his wife have NEARLY FOUR THOUSAND TIMES more money than most people in the UK, or, if you subtract one from the other, about £1,200,000,000 more money than the average UK household. The Sunak family could literally count most net worth as a rounding error!

      Scale on that… well… scale is hard for humans to grasp, but it really does matter in this case

      Now I’m not saying he should pay for all of it personally, but he should certainly stop making a song and dance about it and pay his own fair share! The average UK household paid about £55,641 in tax last year. Rishi Sunak pair £1,900,000. Yes that’s more but it’s only 34 times more. Lets be generous and assume that his wife paid twice as much so it;s 100 times more (she doesn’t, she’s officially non-domiciled and therefore pays about £30,000 to avoid paying UK tax of potentially £20,000,000 in tax), that’s still about 2.5% percent of the average taxation as a percentage of net worth.

      This should make you angry