• @jordanlund@lemmy.world
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    918 days ago

    Windows at least makes sense when you understand the reasoning.

    For years websites have been warning people their OS is out of date if it detected they were running Windows 95 or Windows 98.

    They did this by pulling the version and displaying the warning “if version = Windows 9*”

    So it would have been super embarrassing to have a brand new OS trigger out of date warnings. Skip over Windows 9 and go straight to 10, problem solved.

    • @zewm@lemmy.zip
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      258 days ago

      That should be up to the websites to fix, not Microsoft.

      This seems like a made up reason.

      • @m_f@midwest.social
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        458 days ago

        There’s at least one example you can look at, the Jenkins CI project had code like that (if (name.startsWith("windows 9")) {):

        https://issues.jenkins.io/secure/attachment/18777/PlatformDetail

        Microsoft, for all their faults, do (or at least did) take backwards compatibility very seriously, and the option of “just make devs fix it” would never fly. Here’s a story about how they added special code to Windows 95 to make SimCity’s broken code work on it:

        Windows 95? No problem. Nice new 32 bit API, but it still ran old 16 bit software perfectly. Microsoft obsessed about this, spending a big chunk of change testing every old program they could find with Windows 95. Jon Ross, who wrote the original version of SimCity for Windows 3.x, told me that he accidentally left a bug in SimCity where he read memory that he had just freed. Yep. It worked fine on Windows 3.x, because the memory never went anywhere. Here’s the amazing part: On beta versions of Windows 95, SimCity wasn’t working in testing. Microsoft tracked down the bug and added specific code to Windows 95 that looks for SimCity. If it finds SimCity running, it runs the memory allocator in a special mode that doesn’t free memory right away. That’s the kind of obsession with backward compatibility that made people willing to upgrade to Windows 95.

        • @umbrella@lemmy.ml
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          118 days ago

          video drivers do this nowadays.

          its part of the reason your nvidia driver is gigabytes in size (other than the bloat)

          • @Dudewitbow@lemmy.zip
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            108 days ago

            part of the reason why Nvidias drivers are larger is because theres a lot of functionality that nvidia throws onto as software rather than hardware. after kepler, nvidia moved the hardware scheduler off the gpu and into the driver. this resulted in lower power consumption, but higher cpu usage (reletive to amd). Its why AMD gpus fare better when paired with a aging cpu than Nvidia does.

              • @Dudewitbow@lemmy.zip
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                17 days ago

                i cant remember the article that mentions the archetectual change, but theres a few videos, one by Hardware Unboxed that goes over the phenomena.

                I first learned of it when a user who was using an i7-3770k “upgraded” from an AMD R9-290 to a Nvidia 1070 for battlefield reasons (idr which one). the user essentially lost FPS because he was being heavily CPU bottlenecked due to the Nvidia GPU/Driver.

                • @umbrella@lemmy.ml
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                  7 days ago

                  that explains that effort to improve gpu scheduling in windows 10 a few years ago. turns out they were just compensating for this.

                  ill look this video up, i love this subject but its hard to get information about it like this!

      • @gravitas_deficiency@sh.itjust.works
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        228 days ago

        It’s absolutely not a made-up reason.

        It was a way to get around the fact that Microsoft didn’t use proper version numbers for ages, and it became standard (enough) practice such that MS had to account for it if they didn’t want to break legacy support for a shitload of software that enterprises customers care about.

      • @deegeese@sopuli.xyz
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        158 days ago

        It’s not websites, it was about local apps.

        There are a bunch of 20 year old apps designed for Windows XP which would complain that Windows 9 is too old.

      • @jordanlund@lemmy.world
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        68 days ago

        Can you imagine? “Microsoft demands all websites update their code for new operating system.”

        The alternative being “Why websites think your new computer is old.”

        Microsoft dodged all of that by skipping a version number and the worst question they get asked is “Where did Windows 9 go?”

        They even had tshirts that said “Because 7 8 9”.

      • @saigot@lemmy.ca
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        47 days ago

        Say should all you want, when the user has been using an app for 20 years and then an update breaks it they blame Microsoft not the app. Although I think a big part of it was also choosing 10 as a nice round number for their “”“final”“” os.

        • splicerslicer
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          7 days ago

          The “final” thing was never true though. Wholey based on an off the cuff remark by one engineer.

    • @Voyajer@lemmy.world
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      108 days ago

      How many sites were checking for pre-NT windows versions at all at the time of the release of windows 10?

    • @KoalaUnknown@lemmy.world
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      58 days ago

      Apple’s kind of makes sense too. The removal of the home button was probably the biggest change ever made to the iPhone so they probably wanted a more impactful number/letter. Also, it was the 10th anniversary of the iPhone.

  • @MTK@lemmy.world
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    649 days ago

    Wait until you hear about xbox skipping 1 to 359!

    They did get back to try and redo it but then quit after 1!

        • @scharf_2x40@lemmy.world
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          38 days ago

          Yeah it is, the exact number is 25104128675558732292929443748812027705165520269876079766872595193901106138220937419666018009000254169376172314360982328660708071123369979853445367910653872383599704355532740937678091491429440864316046925074510134847025546014098005907965541041195496105311886173373435145517193282760847755882291690213539123479186274701519396808504940722607033001246328398800550487427999876690416973437861078185344667966871511049653888130136836199010529180056125844549488648617682915826347564148990984138067809999604687488146734837340699359838791124995957584538873616661533093253551256845056046388738129702951381151861413688922986510005440943943014699244112555755279140760492764253740250410391056421979003289600000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000

          • @jaybone@lemmy.world
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            28 days ago

            Thanks! I’m still surprised at the number of trailing zeros though. Is that a function of how many multiples of ten there are in the factorial?

            • @Natanael@slrpnk.net
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              58 days ago

              Just looked it up

              https://www.purplemath.com/modules/factzero.htm

              If we take the factorial of any number larger than 5, then there will be at least one zero at the end of the number. Why? Because 5! = 1×2×3×4×5; in particular, 5! = (2×5)×(1×3×4), and (2×5) = 10. The factorial of any larger number will have more copies of 2 and 5 (as factors of larger values, like 6 and 15), so there will be even more factors of 10 in these factorials. And every factor of 10 adds a zero to the end of the factorial expansion.

    • Zagorath
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      348 days ago

      Windows has been weird since long before the event the OP mentions though.

      Normal up until 3.1, then:

      • 95
      • 98
      • 2000
      • ME
      • XP
      • Vista
      • 7 (internally, actually 6.1)
      • 8 (internally, actually 6.2)
      • 8.1 (internally, actually 6.3 and therefore as significant as 7 -> 8)

      Also, the hilarious alleged reason they did it. Not (just) because of the marketing boost associated with version 10, but because they specifically wanted to avoid the number 9 out of backwards compatibility concerns. Some old code would actually detect it’s running on “either 95 or 98” by doing a string comparison of the version number returned by the OS, and seeing if it started with ‘9’.

      Rather than risk maybe causing some compatibility problems with an edge case in software from the early '00s, they figured “just skip it entirely”.

      • @zeppo@lemmy.world
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        118 days ago

        Ha, urgh… the string checking thing is amusing. That’s not even counting that ME was the last DOS based one, and there was NT 3.1, 3.5, and 4, then 2000 was NT 5.0… and XP and everything after that. Then internally XP was NT 5.1, 5.2, and Vista was NT 6. Windows 7? NT 6.1. Windows 8: NT 6.2. Then Windows 10? NT 10,0. Now the latest Windows 11 is uh, 23H2.

      • @bamboo@lemmy.blahaj.zone
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        28 days ago

        I haven’t used windows in ages, but I do remember compatibility mode, and you could select the OS a program should be compatible with. Why couldn’t they have had Windows 9, and for apps with issues, you could run in compatibility mode for XP?

      • Deceptichum
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        128 days ago

        That makes sense.

        USB 1,2,3,4 is the standard and relates to the speeds.

        USB A, B, C, Micro, Mini refers to the shape.

        • @onion@feddit.de
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          8 days ago

          USB 3.0 Gen 1 and 3.1 Gen 1 and 3.2 Gen 1 are 5Gb/s, 3.1 Gen 2 and 3.2 Gen 2 are 10Gb/s and 3.2 Gen 2×2 is 20Gb/s. Then there’s Thunderbolt 3 with 40Gb/s or 10Gb/s.

          USB4 can be 0.5, 10, 20, 40, 80 or 120Gb/s

          Note that it is oficially “USB4” with no space

        • @9point6@lemmy.world
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          148 days ago

          I wish they’d stuck to what you’re describing, it’s gone incredibly off the rails since that though

        • @Kecessa@sh.itjust.works
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          88 days ago

          USB 3.2 Gen 2x2

          But now it’s by speed instead… But there’s USB 3 and USB 4 with 20Gbps speed which are both named USB 20 Gbps…

  • I believe Apple just never made the 9 because that would have confused people. The 8 and the X dropped the same year due to the 10 year anniversary of iPhones so it was a special case.

    Chronologically, they’d have to go back to the 9 and then the next phone would be the 11 because the X already exists, so going straight to 11 makes sense to not confuse the masses for me.

  • セリャスト
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    99 days ago

    Am I the only one nostalgic for old iOS? I remember how everyone was so amazed at how iOS 6 looked

    • Cosmonaut_Collin
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      89 days ago

      Old ios updates were significant. I don’t know when it changed, but now there is hardly a difference in versions.

      • Deceptichum
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        88 days ago

        Do we want huge changes every few years over minor tweaks and improvements? Like the basics of most phone OS are pretty functional and standard at this stage.

        • @Takumidesh@lemmy.world
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          48 days ago

          Yea android was the same, those huge changes were the result of an emerging tech that we (the population at large) hadn’t really figured out yet.

          Smartphones are entering maturity so it makes sense to me that changes become smaller and move slower, any given update pushed out affects a billion people.

          • Cosmonaut_Collin
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            38 days ago

            They can still update the OS without changing the major change number and only update the minor change and patch numbers. I just feel that they update the main number for advertising purposes instead of doing it as a telltale sign of what kind of changes are in the OS.

            • @Zink@programming.dev
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              18 days ago

              Selling the newness is definitely part of the marketing. Phone number goes up, ios number goes up, chip number goes up. If you are obsessed with having the newest shit, suddenly you no longer have the newest shit.

              I have wondered if phone companies in general and Apple in particular might move to a two-year cycle. But given the size of Apple and the way some people get their new shit as a status symbol, moving to a 2-year phone update cycle would probably lose them literal billions.

          • @AA5B@lemmy.world
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            28 days ago

            Maybe now we’ll have the choice of phones that last longer, are supported longer.

            Apple has been pretty good about this and generally end support on significant architectural changes, but if the change is a faster processor and new sensor, they ought to be able to support hardware longer without more effort

  • Deceptichum
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    8 days ago

    I’d say Nintendo products or Street Fighter games take the crown for wacky inconsistency.

  • Zagorath
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    58 days ago

    Apple’s done this with more than just iPhones.

    Mac OS didn’t do this, but the marketing of version 10 as “OS X” set the stage for everything to come later. With other products, they did it with Final Cut Pro X and QuickTime X

    iMovie also did something interesting where they went from marketing by year of release to version 10. Luckily, there was iMovie '09 and iMovie '11 before that, but no 2010 version. So limited confusion.

  • @Ddub@lemmy.ca
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    58 days ago

    Red hat Linux has managed to flame out on the cusp of v9 twice too, so maybe $4…

  • @foggianism@lemmy.world
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    -28 days ago

    Big companies are doing this so they can sell their product on the Chinese market more easily. The number 9 is associated with death in China.

    • Mr Fish
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      348 days ago

      That’s 4, not 9. The words for death and 4 in Cantonese sound similar, I think with only a small tone difference.

      Also, in a similar way, 14 is close to “must die,” and 24 is close to “easy to die”

      • @madcaesar@lemmy.world
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        118 days ago

        🤣 People still believe in talking to imaginary friends with superpowers. Magic numbers are tame by comparison.

      • @HootinNHollerin@lemmy.world
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        8 days ago

        In china, absolutely. Phone numbers, license plates, condo building floors etc. 8 is good and those fetch high price and 4 is avoided. Hell the US is still sometimes avoiding floor 13 in hotels.

      • TheRealKuni
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        58 days ago

        When I worked at a restaurant and someone’s order came to $6.66, they would sometimes add or remove items to prevent that order total. Always made me chuckle.

      • @Droggelbecher@lemmy.world
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        48 days ago

        I went to the US in 2013 and there were still a lot of hotels (and I think some other places but I’m not sure) that skipped the 13th floor and room number 13

        • @son_named_bort@lemmy.world
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          18 days ago

          I used to have a CD that skipped track 13. It went from 12 to 14. If I put it on track 13 it would have like 5 seconds of silence before going to track 14.

        • @Voyajer@lemmy.world
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          18 days ago

          Interesting, I haven’t seen anything like that. I’ll have to keep a look out for missing room numbers next time I’m in a hotel.