• KillingTimeItself@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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    6 months ago

    i mean, yeah it is complex. It’s fucking war.

    War isn’t simple. Let alone war with history, and multiple decades, coming up to a century worth of history soon.

    This war is the kindergarten equivalent of “no i said it first”

    • Cyclohexane@lemmy.ml
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      6 months ago

      It being a war doesn’t negate the simple conclusion that it is a genocide. If you have reason to deny that, you should provide proper reasoning rather than the hand wavy “it’s a war, surely it has to be complex!”. There are complex aspects to a war that do not negate the simplicity of classifying it as a genocide. The conclusion is simple due to the mountains of undeniable evidence.

      • KillingTimeItself@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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        6 months ago

        It being a war doesn’t negate the simple conclusion that it is a genocide.

        not inherently, but it being a genocide doesn’t also automatically include the whole of the war.

        Ever notice how literature on the holocaust mostly talks about the fact that the germans murdered like what? 13 million people, i couldn’t tell you off the top of my head, rather than how germany uses military tactics to their advantage. And fails at them.

        Also contextually, genocide should be used in past tense. You think the jews under nazi regime were bitching about the mass homicide? Nah they were busy getting the fuck out of germany so they weren’t fucking murdered.

        Ironically, it’s a pretty fucking first world problem to be able to sit here and complain and cry about genocide that isn’t even happening to you. But presumably happening to another party, whom we’ve deemed the recipient of it, presumably ignoring the entire history of this conflict so far. As well as the fact that it’s hard to determine any real numbers on this, considering it’s literally a war.

        Why aren’t people complaining about russia genociding their soliders? They’re doing the same fucking thing! This is arguably worse than israel palestine right now because these are the countries own fucking people.

        The reason i said “its a war, it’s complex” is because i’d literally be here for 3 fucking hours, typing until i hit the world limit multiple fucking times just to iterate my point once. Forgive me if i’m being a little brief here.

        Like don’t get me wrong, i get it, i’m not a huge fan of the fact that we’re sending material to an ally who is using it effectively murder without consequence. Only to be brushed off by our leadership, i would think complaining about the fact that we’re doing this shit, rather than the fact that what we’re doing is enabling another independent entity to murder thousands of people every day, or whatever the stat is.

        This is like being a friend of someone who’s experiencing an abusive relationship, and instead of telling them directly, you bitch at their abusive partner directly, expecting that to make them treat your friend better? Somehow?

        There are complex aspects to a war that do not negate the simplicity of classifying it as a genocide. The conclusion is simple due to the mountains of undeniable evidence.

        also linguistically, you literally cannot classify a war as a genocide. That’s not fucking possible, this is like classifying a car as a boat. A war can include genocide, as demonstrated ever so lovingly by the germans during that one world war. They are two distinct parts of a collective whole here.

        • Sodium_nitride@lemmygrad.ml
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          6 months ago

          Why aren’t people complaining about russia genociding their soliders?

          Barely down the comments section and I already see Russia lmao.

          This is like being a friend of someone who’s experiencing an abusive relationship, and instead of telling them directly, you removed at their abusive partner directly, expecting that to make them treat your friend better? Somehow?

          The fuck else do think everyone hating on and protesting in college campuses and against Biden is doing? Also, he is not my friend or your friend. And he is in no abusive relationship. This is 2 serial killers hanging out and giving each other assistance. You can’t kill either one as they are well protected, but you can slash their tires.

          also linguistically, you literally cannot classify a war as a genocide. That’s not fucking possible, this is like classifying a car as a boat. A war can include genocide, as demonstrated ever so lovingly by the germans during that one world war. They are two distinct parts of a collective whole here.

          Ah metaphysics, my old friend. War is not a static, isotropic constant that remains unchanged throughout the universe like a water molecule or the speed of light. The nature of the war itself fundamentally changes depending on the millions of factors that give it context, amongst them, genocide being a big one.

      • TexMexBazooka@lemm.ee
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        6 months ago

        What gets me is people who throw a fit when you point Hamas isn’t exactly awesome, even if they are fighting for very justified reasons

        • KillingTimeItself@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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          6 months ago

          as far as i can tell, from the history i’ve seen, neither side is particularly justified IMO. Including the lengthy history of documented treaty negotiations as well.

        • bigschnitz@lemmy.world
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          6 months ago

          They are literally fighting for the extermination of the Jewish state and aim to eradicate the Jewish population from the region.

          The Islamic colonial powers have a long history of persecuting the Jewish population in the region which was (and should Hamas be successful, again will be) every bit as despicable as what Israel are doing to the Palestinians now.

          In this conflict, the only possible justice is for both sides to lose and a two state solution be implemented.

    • Ozone6363@lemmy.world
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      6 months ago

      Wait, you mean the conflict can’t be broken down into one simple tweet from some random woman?

      • Cyclohexane@lemmy.ml
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        6 months ago

        The tweet does not claim to summarize the entire conflict, but only promote the undeniable fact that it is a genocide.

        • KillingTimeItself@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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          6 months ago

          again, a war cannot in it of itself be genocide, a war however can perpetrate genocide.

          Much like a car can perpetrate transportation, but in it of itself is not literally transportation.

          • hglman@lemmy.ml
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            6 months ago

            Amazing, you stopped genocide with semantics. Truly inspiring feat.

            • KillingTimeItself@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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              6 months ago

              i didn’t stop it. Do you actually have 3 braincells?

              A war can happen independently but at the same time as a genocide, and you can have a genocide without a war, the two are not intrinsically related.

              By this argument i’ve completely destroyed the transportation industry, because there is no more fucking transportation.

          • Cyclohexane@lemmy.ml
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            6 months ago

            You do not have to say it “again”. I ignored it the first time because there’s no logical reasoning or evidence for this. Until you do, it’s not something that I can respond to.

      • KillingTimeItself@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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        6 months ago

        you mean to tell me the conflict that started officially in the year 1948 has nearly 70 years of history up to now, and has many involved parties, all of whom reside in the middle east, which is notorious for calm conflict resolution?

              • KillingTimeItself@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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                6 months ago

                my original comment? Didn’t even once mention genocide.

                Just talked about the fact that there’s an ongoing war, which is very much true. I don’t think there’s any global entity that hasn’t classified this as a war. Even germany was committing war during their little escapade.

                Do i think that israel is committing genocide? Idk, it depends on the definition of genocide on whether or not that actually holds up the local population at hand, because i know very little about the demographics of the middle east, weird how that one works.

                Do you think war IS genocide, and that genocide is not war? Because that would be a weird way to phrase things. I don’t think you can classify war itself as genocide, based on the very act of war itself, being fundamentally irrelevant most of the time, and the times it has been relevant, it’s only tangentially relevant.