FCC chair: Speed standard of 25Mbps down, 3Mbps up isn’t good enough anymore::Chair proposes 100Mbps national standard and an evaluation of broadband prices.

  • dji386@infosec.pub
    link
    fedilink
    English
    arrow-up
    138
    arrow-down
    8
    ·
    1 year ago

    It’s 2023. Anything less than symmetrical gigabit is nonsense. We shouldn’t have to settle for overpriced crumbs from ISPs.

    • imperator3733@lemmy.world
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      59
      arrow-down
      8
      ·
      1 year ago

      Symmetrical gigabit is a bit much for a baseline. Should it be widely available for all, and for a good price? Absolutely. But plenty of people (probably a majority even) could be adequately served by something like 300 down/100 up as a baseline tier.

      • Justice@lemmygrad.ml
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        37
        arrow-down
        2
        ·
        edit-2
        1 year ago

        Let me go ahead and steal a quote from JFK:

        “We choose to [build nationwide symmetrical gigabit fiber] in this decade and do the other things, not because they are easy, but because they are hard; because that goal will serve to organize and measure the best of our energies and skills, because that challenge is one that we are willing to accept, one we are unwilling to postpone, and one we intend to win, and the others, too.”

        • John “I hate my worthless nephew RFK Jr.”Fitzpatrick Kennedy
      • vzq@lemmy.world
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        25
        ·
        1 year ago

        It’s not about what people need. It’s about building infrastructure for new services and applications.

        Besides, digging a trench is digging a trench. Just put in the fiber. It’s 2023.

      • Neshura@bookwormstory.social
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        18
        ·
        1 year ago

        imo the asymmetry only serves to upsell content creators to business plans. I do agree with you on the speeds though, gigabit is a bit overblown for average joe but it should be an option in most places for people that need it (Content Creators, WFH Visual Artists, Garage Startups)

    • regbin_@lemmy.world
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      23
      arrow-down
      2
      ·
      1 year ago

      IMO the focus should be on lowering the prices. A lot of people in my country still rely on spotty mobile data as their primary internet. Imagine 100 mbps fiber for $10 a month, that would be awesome.

    • RvTV95XBeo@sh.itjust.works
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      9
      ·
      1 year ago

      I don’t disagree, but I think even just setting it to 500M symmetrical would be a MASSIVE improvement and a more achievable goal. Few regions right now are equipped for fiber and even fewer homes.

      Most homes in the US have a coax connection, and with current tech coax connections can do a little over a gig bandwidth total (up+down). That said, we should be quickly ratcheting up to 500/500 while the fiber rollout hopefully accelerates.

      • nilloc@discuss.tchncs.de
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        11
        ·
        1 year ago

        The depressing part is how much fiber is out there, but dark or locked in ridiculous agreements with private owners that will keep it from being the municipal service it deserves to be.

        • vagrantprodigy@lemmy.whynotdrs.org
          link
          fedilink
          English
          arrow-up
          2
          ·
          1 year ago

          The last house I owned had fiber in the front yard that the ISP refused to hook up. The entire neighborhood (300+ houses) had the same situation. Verizon laid the fiber, and Frontier refused to let anyone use it.

      • BorgDrone@lemmy.one
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        1
        ·
        1 year ago

        Why does it matter if it’s 500/500 or 1000/1000? Once the fiber is there it makes no difference. In fact, 500Mbit symmetrical is probably more expensive to deploy.

        • RvTV95XBeo@sh.itjust.works
          link
          fedilink
          English
          arrow-up
          1
          ·
          1 year ago

          Once the fiber is there it makes no difference

          Because the fiber isn’t there. We could achieve 500/500 on current networks without running fiber to every single home. I’m just saying it’s a good interim goal as we work towards a full fiber rollout.

    • MeanEYE@lemmy.world
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      1
      ·
      1 year ago

      Funny thing is, they are selling vapor. They are renting the usage of equipment, nothing more. There’s no finite amount of internet and you have to use it carefully. Sure there’s limits in that equipment, but essentially prices are all over-inflated. In my shitty little country I have 350/150 for around 15€, 300 channels TV included. For gigabit I’d pay a bit more, around 30€.

  • AA5B@lemmy.world
    link
    fedilink
    English
    arrow-up
    42
    ·
    edit-2
    1 year ago

    Holy shit, there are people still using 25/3? How the heck can you function with that? I’m not entirely facetious: with trackers and ads and “web 2.0” nonsense and way over provisioning , I’ve seen “simple” web sites bog down on much faster connections.

    As one data point, my ex had Comcast’s, I think 50/5 or something, and my kids constantly complained about the network over there. Part of it is being spoiled by my true gigabit symmetrical, part of it is the worst company in America, but the reality is that it’s noticeable

    • regbin_@lemmy.world
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      22
      arrow-down
      3
      ·
      edit-2
      1 year ago

      25/3 is perfectly usable for a single user, provided you don’t need to upload stuff. Watching 1080p60 on YouTube only needs slightly over 12 mbps.

      I’m not defending the current state of the internet services, just saying it’s not that bad.

    • u/lukmly013 💾 (lemmy.sdf.org)@lemmy.sdf.org
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      14
      arrow-down
      1
      ·
      1 year ago

      Honestly I am really happy when I get such high speeds. 25Mbps feels blazing fast for me. Everything loading/downloading so quickly. An average song in the FLAC 16/44 format would download in just 10 seconds instead of up to 5 minutes.

      And there’s already even 10Gbps available. I can’t even imagine that. You could download a whole 4K movie in a matter of seconds!

      Anyway, this is what I have:
      Image link for compatibility

      I can only dream.

      • AA5B@lemmy.world
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        1
        ·
        1 year ago

        I think one of the issues I have with “normal” bandwidth is being spoiled by gigabit fiber. I don’t do anything to require that kind of bandwidth, not even close, but it just works. No matter what I do. Every time

        Cable internet is notoriously poor and it really is. Sure, your minimum standard high speed internet is mathematically more than I need, “up to” more than I need, but the reality is far worse. I regularly see network lag and high latency, it regularly causes visible issues. It tends to be slow and frustrating even when the advertised speeds shouldn’t be.

        If we’re going to set a standard based on advertised speeds, we need to do the same math that providers use to set a more useable standard. Or we can set the standard to actual speeds and watch them scream

      • partizan@lemm.ee
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        2
        arrow-down
        1
        ·
        1 year ago

        well, if you have the money for it, you can get starlink, but its far from cheap. But since you are at cellular network, a 4G receiver with good placement can much improve on those speeds. I assume you are in some signal shadow, and swan never had too good coverage outside large cities… Maybe try some other operator ?

        • u/lukmly013 💾 (lemmy.sdf.org)@lemmy.sdf.org
          link
          fedilink
          English
          arrow-up
          1
          ·
          1 year ago

          For 13EUR/month I sure could get faster speeds, but also fairly small data limits. Here I get 300GB/month.

          Maybe the nearby cell towers are overloaded, I don’t know. But at midnight it can go up to 45Mbps. The speed peaks around 2-3AM.
          Also there’s the free national roaming in Orange 2G/3G network. So if I really need faster internet speeds, I can use Orange 3G HSPA+ which is pretty reliable, although with 20GB/month cap.

          • sznio@lemmy.world
            link
            fedilink
            English
            arrow-up
            2
            ·
            1 year ago

            Cellular is always overloaded in rural areas. Mobile ISPs always take on more customers than their infrastructure can handle.

    • WaterWaiver@aussie.zone
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      9
      ·
      edit-2
      1 year ago

      My whole family house is on 25/5 in Australia. Most of laptops in the house are 1366x768 (so 720p youtube video) and we use adblockers.

      The key is setting up proper queue control on your router (Openwrt + SQM) so that one person downloading or uploading doesn’t ruin the latency for everyone else browsing the web; before I did that a single person downloading a steam game or uploading something to Google drive made the web unbrowsable for everyone. Sadly this only works if your internet connection link speed is stable and reliable.

      I’m not entirely facetious: with trackers and ads and “web 2.0” nonsense and way over provisioning , I’ve seen “simple” web sites bog down on much faster connections.

      A lot of web 2.0 nonsense slowness is caused by executing megabytes of javascript. Fetching the few MB itself isn’t the bottleneck for us :)

    • FoulBeastie@lemmy.world
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      3
      ·
      1 year ago

      Best connection available in my town is a super overpriced 25/3, but what you actually get is more like 10/0.5. No fiber lines, no other providers around other than satellite, and no demand for more means it’s just stagnant here

    • ebits21@lemmy.ca
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      3
      arrow-down
      1
      ·
      1 year ago

      I have this and find it fine 🤷🏻‍♂️

      I can watch video streaming fine, browse fine, multiple family members.

      Yeah fast would be nicer but I don’t really have issues.

    • Zarxrax@lemmy.world
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      3
      arrow-down
      2
      ·
      1 year ago

      I get like 20mbps down and it’s fine. Netflix only recommends 15 Mbps for 4k streaming. Lol, looking at websites and stuff is certainly not a problem. About the only time speed has ever been an issue is if I need to download a large game on steam. But I attribute that more to developers just being too lazy to actually optimize their games. I shouldn’t need to download 50 gigabytes to play some game when I’m just running at medium settings.

  • Flying Squid@lemmy.world
    link
    fedilink
    English
    arrow-up
    37
    ·
    1 year ago

    Here’s an interesting thing- we had Spectrum on copper and we’re semi-rural so it was only about 30/5. Then a local company came in and offered to install fiber in the neighborhood if 40% signed up. Suddenly our Spectrum speeds went up to about 80/10. Then the neighborhood told Spectrum to fuck off and now we have decent fiber speeds. I’m getting 400/400 now and I could get it even faster if I wanted to pay for it.

    • mr_tyler_durden@lemmy.world
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      18
      ·
      1 year ago

      Yep, typical. Spectrum in my area (like 5-7 years ago) suddenly over doubled everyone’s speeds almost overnight once competition came in. I loved telling them to pound sand as I got symmetrical gigabit installed.

  • MisterD@lemmy.ca
    link
    fedilink
    English
    arrow-up
    25
    arrow-down
    1
    ·
    1 year ago

    Yes, let’s pay them to just take the money… for the third time!

  • QubaXR@lemmy.world
    link
    fedilink
    English
    arrow-up
    24
    arrow-down
    2
    ·
    edit-2
    1 year ago

    Asymmetric speeds are a disgrace. Internet used to be about exchange of content, ideas and collaboration. You consumed, but also contributed. The overall focus on high download low upload is clearly the sign telcos want Internet to be just a troth of content, not much different from cable tv.

  • Melatonin@lemmy.dbzer0.com
    link
    fedilink
    English
    arrow-up
    17
    arrow-down
    1
    ·
    edit-2
    1 year ago

    Pathetic. The acceptance of this terrible service speed shows how the American public is so isolated they don’t know when they’re being shafted by big business and the politicians the rich and powerful own.

    No more lobbying. Institutionalized bribery is killing the American public. Healthcare, food, workplace rights and safety, and quality of services. Everything’s compromised.

    • Volt@pawb.social
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      17
      ·
      1 year ago

      To clear up confusion, 6MBps (MegaByte) down would be equal to 48Mbps (Megabit). So you would be above the mentioned standard.

      Or you made typo, then you’re indeed below standard ^^"

        • Ricaz@lemmy.world
          link
          fedilink
          English
          arrow-up
          13
          ·
          edit-2
          1 year ago

          One is a rate of data, the other is an amount.

          Mbps means megabits per second.

          MB is just megabytes. You can of course turn it into a rate, but then it would be MB/s.

          There are 8 bits in a byte, so 100 Mbps would be 12.5 MB/s (divide by 8)

  • KiloPapa@lemmy.world
    link
    fedilink
    English
    arrow-up
    15
    ·
    1 year ago

    I live in hotels. A good week is when I can measure in Mb and not Kb. A great one is when it’s more than 3mbps on a regular basis.😢

  • danafest@lemm.ee
    link
    fedilink
    English
    arrow-up
    12
    ·
    1 year ago

    I was so happy when we finally got a 2nd internet provider where I live. Now both providers offer steep discounts to keep customers. I upgraded my 450mpbs coax connection to 1gbps fiber when the new ISP came to town. My promotional period just ran out, so I called the ISP. They set me up with a new promotion for 2gbps at less than the price I was paying for 1gbps, and at the end of the promotional period it’ll be the same price I was paying for the 1gbps service. Competition ftw!

  • FantasticFox@lemmy.world
    link
    fedilink
    English
    arrow-up
    11
    ·
    1 year ago

    I have 500Mbps in Spain. Is it that bad in the American cities or is it only like rural Montana that has these speeds?

    • dman87@sh.itjust.works
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      10
      ·
      1 year ago

      Honestly, it’s highly variable. Generally speaking, more populated areas tend to have much better options for internet and in some large markets even have a degree of competition.

      In my case, I live in a town of only 180k or so people. At my home, I am able to get 1.2 gbps download from Comcast. They are the only option in my direct vicinity with this much bandwidth. The alernative is AT&T with only DSL as an option. I don’t remember the top tier. But, it’s considerably slower at maybe 100 mbps or something like that.

      • FantasticFox@lemmy.world
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        3
        ·
        1 year ago

        Wow, that’s pretty good for a town of that size. I live in a city of 1.6 Million. I think I might be able to get 1 gbps if I shop around, but I don’t think much more than that is available to normal consumers at least.

      • xxythrowaway@lemmynsfw.com
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        2
        ·
        1 year ago

        I’ve lived in small towns since 2009. 100mps would be a fucking dream come true. The fastest speed I’ve had in the last decade plus is 25mps until we got TMobile home internet, and now I typically get around 50-70. Technically it’s up to 300 with our distance to the tower, but there’s a fucking mountain in between us, so I take what I can get. :/

        • xxythrowaway@lemmynsfw.com
          link
          fedilink
          English
          arrow-up
          1
          ·
          1 year ago

          Can’t figure out how to edit on connect, so I’m just adding:

          The best wired internet available to me is dialup (old school 56k, baby). We used a mobile hotspot from PCs for people (if you’re at all low income, seriously check them out. Life changers).

    • Asifall@lemmy.world
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      9
      ·
      1 year ago

      The issue is mostly that it’s highly variable, hard to change without moving, and hard to predict before you actually live somewhere.

      The comcast rep will happily take your money to put you on a 200mb plan, but it won’t do shit if the infrastructure in your area is bad, and Comcast (or whoever the isp is) has absolutely zero responsibility to actually provide the promised services. Now you add in that 95% of the population including most of the phone reps working for the ISPs don’t even know the difference between a bit and a byte and it becomes a total crap shoot.

      • Demdaru@lemmy.world
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        3
        ·
        1 year ago

        …wow. That’s so shit. Where I live, your internet provider has to have the ability to provide the service or like with every other service provider it’s really open for lawyer action.

        This also makes so that internet providers are at the same time keeping their own infrastructure around which in turn makes that yet another selling point (“we have up to 1 gbps in your area!”) and makes them keep it in top-notch condition.

      • FantasticFox@lemmy.world
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        3
        ·
        1 year ago

        That’s the same here too. My first apartment only had ADSL. In 2015.

        I couldn’t even watch Netflix without it stopping to buffer.

        I really wish they would put internet speeds on apartment offers etc.

    • BartsBigBugBag@lemmy.tf
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      5
      ·
      1 year ago

      I live in the mountain area, and my friend lives 30m from a multi-million population city, in an area with over 100,000 residents. His best option for internet to this day is hotspotting from his cell. Before that was viable, he only had access to satellite internet. Even semi-rural people here get fucked.

      • TheRealKuni@lemmy.world
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        2
        ·
        1 year ago

        my friend lives 30m from a multi-million population city

        It took me a beat to realize this was 30 miles or 30 minutes and not 30 meters.

        • BartsBigBugBag@lemmy.tf
          link
          fedilink
          English
          arrow-up
          3
          ·
          edit-2
          1 year ago

          Ah that’s my bad, should’ve used metric. I meant minutes, but in context it doesn’t really portray that.

          • TheRealKuni@lemmy.world
            link
            fedilink
            English
            arrow-up
            4
            ·
            1 year ago

            Oh, metric isn’t a requirement (although I myself am striving to use it when I remember), just that “m” alone is ambiguous. And in my daily work, a number followed by a single m is meters.

    • electromage@lemm.ee
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      4
      ·
      1 year ago

      It’s widely variable, even in big cities the available ISPs can change depending on what side of a street you’re on. A lot of people are stuck with cable (DOCSIS) providers that run over legacy TV infrastructure and provide wildly asymmetric speeds. This is an excerpt from Xfinity (Comcast):

      Xfinity Gigabit Internet service has advanced, next generation technology, with WiFi download speeds of up to 1000 Mbps (up to 1200 Mbps in some areas) and upload speeds of up to 35 Mbps.

      • Fordry@lemmy.world
        link
        fedilink
        English
        arrow-up
        2
        ·
        1 year ago

        There’s a new docsis version right around the corner that will provide symmetric speeds. Comcast is starting to roll it out this year. Cable will be a lot faster in a couple years.

    • JiveTurkey@lemmy.world
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      3
      ·
      1 year ago

      I live in middle America and oddly enough the rural areas have started getting fiber from utility companies. I live in a town of about 40,000 and the best you can hope for is either DSL from AT&T which is maybe 25Mbps with perfect conditions or Optimum Cable internet which is sold as “Gigabit” that never breaks 400Mbps and cost about $120/mo. I’ve also had to file multiple complaints with the FCC to have issues resolved. My connection for about 6 months was completely unusable when it rained and even after “fixing” the issue I have severely reduced speeds when it rains. It’s an absolute joke and nothing is in place to protect consumers from any of this BS.

  • harbo@lemmy.world
    link
    fedilink
    English
    arrow-up
    9
    ·
    1 year ago

    I want fiber internet so bad, I live in a relatively big city for Christ’s sake it shouldn’t take this long

  • Obinice@lemmy.world
    link
    fedilink
    English
    arrow-up
    10
    arrow-down
    1
    ·
    1 year ago

    They considered that a standard? 25 meg?

    Jesus wept. I haven’t had internet that slow in well over a decade here in the UK!

    How do they manage things like 150GB game downloads over there, or 3 or 4 people all using the connection at the same time…

    • Perhyte@lemmy.world
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      5
      ·
      1 year ago

      Not so much a standard as in “everyone should actually use the internet at this speed” but more as in “the bare minimum level, everyone should have at least this speed available (and we’ll help pay to upgrade people stuck at slower speeds)”, I believe.

      It was still a low speed for that of course. It apparently hadn’t been raised since the Obama administration (2015).


      Rural internet speeds are often… not comparable to more densely populated areas, shall we say. My (European) perspective: I had about ~3 Mbit down (over ADSL) until I moved about a decade ago (on a good day, while paying for “up to 40 Mbit” (IIRC) that the line apparently just could not physically deliver to my house). Meanwhile, 1 km along the road people in town had cable internet (~100 Mbit down).

      Luckily, both populations have since benefited from a fiber rollout by a smaller telco, but people in town still got that upgrade about 5 years sooner and without paying a ~€2k connection fee. AFAIK there are still areas in my country where ADSL is the best available…

    • antijava@lemmy.world
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      2
      ·
      1 year ago

      I’m in a hotel in London now and am getting less than 10/10. So not necessarily better. I’m an American who normally suffers under Comcast and have 60/25 or so at home.

  • MeanEYE@lemmy.world
    link
    fedilink
    English
    arrow-up
    8
    ·
    1 year ago

    Ajit Pai never raised download speeds? Nooo. You don’t say. Asshole who was against net neutrality didn’t do anything to increase quality of network. Can’t be.