Germany, "Die Welt": AfD's electoral program includes leaving the EU and the euro Read all the latest news on Agenzia Nova
  • TheDrink [he/him]@hexbear.netEnglish
    461·
    27 days ago

    Germany: practically reconquered Europe by forming the EU in which they have obscene power to throw around and make other countries do what they want

    Fascists: we’re gonna tear it down because occasionally we have to make concessions to other rich countries to keep the alliance going

    let them fight tbh

    • BynarsAreOk [none/use name]@hexbear.netEnglish
      21·
      27 days ago

      This fascist uprising is a consequence of 2022 and Germany’s complete economic devastation, its not about concessions to the US at all. More like the general worldwide trend of liberal leftists doing nothing to address the cost of living and austerity crises while the socialist left is suppressed and unable to get a decent platform to propose any real alternatives. EU in general suffered even more than the US.

      Without any alternative people just move to the right. Afd used to be a complete joke irrelevant meme party mere years ago.

      • ☆ Yσɠƚԋσʂ ☆@lemmy.mlOPEnglish
        36·
        27 days ago

        It’s honestly possible once Ukraine collapses. There’s really no repercussions for the US leaving NATO. It’s not like Europe isn’t going to be dependent on US military industry going forward, so all this would do is cut US commitments, and force Europe to buy more weapons as a result. In fact, Trump might leave NATO for this very reason since he keeps complaining that Europeans aren’t paying their fair share.

        • AcidSmiley [she/her]@hexbear.netEnglish
          26·
          27 days ago

          In fact, Trump might leave NATO for this very reason since he keeps complaining that Europeans aren’t paying their fair share.

          He also did that last time he was in office, which successfully pressured other members into spending more on their militaries. Republicans always treat their allies overseas like shit, and it works. Afterwards, the next Democratic president picks up the slack by making the Euros believe Amerika has returned to being friends with them again. Same dynamic with Dubya and Obama. It’s one of the core parts of how well it works for the US to be a one-party state with two ruling parties.

    • mar_k [he/him]@hexbear.netEnglish
      12·
      27 days ago

      as far as i know they’ve always called for stronger relations with NATO and the US. and probably especially now that trump’s getting in

    • Lemister [none/use name]@hexbear.netEnglish
      9·
      27 days ago

      They love trump- so no. German far right is generally split on that issue. The more “palatable” elements are pro-Nato/Eu “white people club only”

    • ☆ Yσɠƚԋσʂ ☆@lemmy.mlOPEnglish
      22·
      27 days ago

      I do think the main hope was to Balkanize Russia so that NATO could start surrounding China from the west, but fucking over Germany was definitely an objective as well. The US was very unhappy that Germany was getting economically integrated with the east, and they had to put a stop to that.

    • Tomorrow_Farewell [any, they/them]@hexbear.netEnglish
      12·
      27 days ago

      The primary goal of the war in Ukraine was not really against Russia, but against Europe

      This seems to be a confident but unsubstantiated claim. Like, what even is the argument here?

      Europe, the US’s true competitor

      And this is outright silly, considering that NATO Europe has effectively been under US control for close to a century now.
      The power that is an actual competitor in this regard is the PRC.

  • grandepequeno [he/him]@hexbear.netEnglish
    13·
    27 days ago

    That’s hard to believe honestly, I assume DW is fearmongering and exaggerating the AfD’s positions since it’s electoral season in germany and the party is polling in 2nd-3rd.

    Either way if it’s real I doubt they’d go through with it.

    • fanbois [he/him]@hexbear.netEnglish
      18·
      27 days ago

      The anti-euro (both currency and organisation) sentiment was at the core of the founders of the AfD in 2013. It got quickly supplanted by a more straight up hard-right-nationalist ideology and has not played much of a role since then, but has always been on the back burner and showed up in singular positions of its deranged members. Them picking it up now seems like a calculated political move to find another scapegoat after refugees, muslims, “Genderwahnsinn” (literally “gender insanity”, which would be a great name for a queer punk band tbh) or what have you.

      Is this an actual position they hold? Who knows, they are fucking fash and will say and do anything to get into power and are not beholden to anything, once in power.

      • grandepequeno [he/him]@hexbear.netEnglish
        11·
        27 days ago

        IIRC from reading Quinn Slobodian’s books on free market radicals the precursor to the AfD were right wing libertarians, and those people used to be afraid that the EU would “smuggle in socialism” through regulations and stuff. Nowadays those type of ideologues mostly love the EU and like you said the AfD itself abandoned that for more protectionist policies and nationalism/scapegoating migrants.

        But I’m sure the leadership understands that germany IS the EU and the euro, and its institutions are set up to make the german economic model the chief beneficiary, so abandoning it entirely instead of reforming it to be even more beneficial to germany seems like a thing they wouldn’t actually follow through.

        Nevertheless it’s dreadful that this type of statement from the article:

        Regarding the exit from the euro, the document states that “AfD is aware that the reintroduction of a stable national currency cannot happen without conversion costs. However, these will be lower than the permanent costs of remaining in the euro system”.

        Is coming from the far right and not the left

    • ☆ Yσɠƚԋσʂ ☆@lemmy.mlOPEnglish
      11·
      27 days ago

      Probably depends on how bad things get economically. The EU has been sucked dry by the three years of proxy war in Ukraine at this point. This winter is expected to be colder than the last two which could lead to a new energy crisis. That could create conditions for Germany to decide they want to reopen the remaining pipeline and try to patch things up with Russia and China.

      • grandepequeno [he/him]@hexbear.netEnglish
        12·
        27 days ago

        We said that the last 2 times and it didn’t happen, I think unless something changes germany will remain committed to atlanticism. And the guy leading the party that’s leading the polls is a huge atlanticist

        • ☆ Yσɠƚԋσʂ ☆@lemmy.mlOPEnglish
          10·
          27 days ago

          What’s changing is that German economy is unravelling. The atlanticist mainstream might squeak by in these elections, but the trends are quickly building against them. It’s also worth noting that it’s not just Germany. France, Slovakia, Czech Republic, Romania, Hungary, are all starting to turn against atlanticism as well.

          The past three years have been really hard on people, and it’s becoming increasingly clear that it was all for nothing. Russia is winning the war, and there’s nothing the west can do about it. People are starting to realize they were being lied to and that their future has been stolen from them.

          • infuziSporg [e/em/eir]@hexbear.netEnglish
            2·
            26 days ago

            Germany. France, Slovakia, Czech Republic, Romania, Hungary, are all starting to turn against atlanticism as well.

            adding austria to scribble a dick on the map to spite europe

      • Lemister [none/use name]@hexbear.netEnglish
        7·
        27 days ago

        Afd is gaining a lot of sympathies amongst the working class due to the fact they allegedly have “an investor” that will restore nordstream 2 and make the economy good again.

        But they hate china a lot. Only BSW may be pro-china to some extent. Die Linke destroyed themselves by embracing radlibery and focusing on electability.

        • ☆ Yσɠƚԋσʂ ☆@lemmy.mlOPEnglish
          3·
          26 days ago

          I think the first step for Germany has to be to gain some measure of sovereignty, which means overthrowing the current US puppet regime. Once that happens, then Germany will end up being integrated economically with the east over time because it’s the only thing that makes sense. The current state of things is not sustainable because it doesn’t make sense economically.

          • Lemister [none/use name]@hexbear.netEnglish
            2·
            26 days ago

            Hell its needs a proper revolution because most of the upper class has ties to the the us, german old money literally study and live in the UK for periods of time.

  • Snackuleata [any]@hexbear.netEnglish
    51·
    27 days ago

    I’m trying to imagine if the fall of the EU will be the free market liberals’ fall of the Soviet Union, but I don’t know if they’d care enough to historicize it like that.