I have no doubt Spez will be thrilled to help further enshitify reddit.
Spez would be thrilled to sell it, I’m sure.
🎶 Elon Musk can suck my dick, suck my dick, suck my dick. Elon Musk can suck my dick, all the blah blah blah… 🎶
it won’t be long before the piggy little fuckboy starts sucking on musk’s nipple and issue some sort of ban to that movement. god it’s good to be off that site
YES? Buy reddit! The death of reddit is only a good thing.
They came after redditors
redditors
one X user claimed the website was “anti-free speech” after he said he was banned from the “comics” subreddit for denying that the tech mogul did a Nazi salute
That sounds like pro truth rather than “anti free speech”, no?
Free speech means having to read and hear things you don’t like or disagree with every now and again. I personally think bans should be restricted to hate speech or else we’ll sleep walk in to an echo chamber.
I personally think bans should be restricted to hate speech
Nazi salutes are hate speech.
Free speech means the government can’t sanction you for unpopular speech. It says absolutely nothing about private citizens.
You’re not entitled to an audience, or to anybody else’s platform.
Moderators on a private website don’t actually have to put up with Nazi liars.
Nice opinion, you’re entitled to that!
Yes they are. And as you said, you personally should be subjected to opinion you don’t like.
Exactly the point, I don’t know why I’m struggling to get that across, apparently people get it when you say it!
Learn the definition of “opinion.”
Opinion:
a view or judgement formed about something, not necessarily based on fact or knowledge
What’s your point? Other than trying to discredit me by insinuating I’m an idiot?
I never thought that endorsing the freedom of speech would be so controversial!
Oh, this is a much more dire educational lack than a single word. You can’t even parse the meaning of a sentence. Sorry, kid.
asks definition of a wordwhen given the definition moves the goal posts in an incredibly condescending way.
Why don’t you stop criticising me as a person and say what you want to say in plain English?
I take it you can’t articulate your problem with my argument and that’s why you have a problem with me instead.
I should be allowed to play the drums in your bedroom at any time of the day or night I please and you’re not allowed to kick me out because freeze peaches
Invasion of privacy, breech of the peace, trespassing and probably more.
Your terrible analogy has almost nothing to do with freedom of speech, if you think a redditor writing an opinion on Musk is equivalent to them playing the drums in your bedroom at night, you might be a tad sensitive.
I understand your view of free speech, but they are also correct that it is a private space like a bedroom. They are in control of that space and made a rule saying not to bring articles from X into that space. The person ignored it and argued about it so they banned them from that space. If someone says don’t bring food into my establishment and I do, I have no right to be mad at them for telling me to leave. If I argue with them I have no right to superceded their banning me from their establishment. The issue isn’t free speech, the issue is respecting an establishments operation policies.
Thank you for understanding that I’m only here to talk about free speech.
If the rules were no X posts, then they should’ve had the post taken down with a warning. I don’t think a lifetime ban is a reasonable response to an undesirable opinion, I don’t think it meets the requirements of hate speech which is where I’d personally draw the line.
That’s exactly my point: all freedoms are limited in certain contexts.
Free speech protects hate speech in the United States, so you’ve already got your wish.
But the Constitution restricts the government, it doesn’t apply to your peers, and nor should it.
Freedom of speech is not a freedom to lie.
Damn, now you got me defending fucking Musk on this issue.
Freedom of speech is also the freedom to lie. However, that just means the state can’t arrest you for your speech. Nobody owes you a platform for your free speech.
That said, Elon Musk is a turd sandwich.
No, freedom of speech doesn’t protect you against false statements. There’s literally a ton of other laws that penalize that, depending on the context. Purgery, slander, libel, breach of contract, just to name a few.
I already said that there were limitations to free speech earlier. But untruth is also protected under the US Constitution. It all relates to a possibility of harm.
If i said that I was the Easter Bunny, it would be a lie, but who is harmed by it?
If I falsely yell fire in a crowded theatre and people get trampled, then harm, or a risk of harm is evident.
These are all standard arguments on free speech. But, yes, there are many carve outs where an untrue statement is protected under law. I just don’t have the time or inclination to list them all. You can check them out yourself.
Freedom of speech is also the freedom to lie
Again, it is not. Freedom of speech is a freedom to receive information and exchange ideas. Not a freedom to lie.
Are you a USian by any chance? They quite often misunderstand what freedom of speech is.
Yes, but in this case we are not talking about a lie, we are talking about an opinion which you yourself consider a lie.
It comes back to objective truth Vs opinion which I have already replied to you about.
Regardless of this, there are cases where lying is protected by the first amendment.
https://www.freedomforum.org/is-lying-protected-first-amendment/
The example of where lying is not protected in the case to which we are referring would be:
Be a provable assertion of fact (not an opinion)
Yes, but in this case we are not talking about a lie, we are talking about an opinion which you yourself consider a lie.
You are going around in circles. I already told you it is fair enough - if he genuinely believed Muskler was not performing a nazi salute, it just makes him deluded. I however consider it unlikely, and if it indeed is not the case, that means he was lying.
Furthermore, Muskler himself never denied him making a nazi salute, making people denying it even more likely to lie rather than simply being mistaken.
Again, it is.
Show me the legalisation where it is illegal to lie. How is it enforced? Who enforces it? Who arbatrates it?
Freedom of speech is a moral right, and nothing more. If you start arresting people on perceived lies, that is a very dangerous slippery slope. I hope that the Donald doesn’t start arresting people who he believes is lying. Where will THAT stop?
And, no, I’m not Asian, tho I don’t understand your asking.
Again, it is.
Again, it isn’t. Read the fucking definition and educate yourself.
‘Freedom of speech is the right to seek, receive and impart information and ideas of all kinds, by any means.’
https://www.amnesty.org.uk/free-speech-freedom-expression-human-right
https://www.un.org/en/about-us/universal-declaration-of-human-rights
And, no, I’m not Asian,
Who was talking about Asians? I asked if you are a USian. Someone from USA. People from USA often misunderstand what freedom of speech is.
sigh
Again it is.
Neither of those links suggested that it was illegal to lie. Why not? Because it is fucking impossible to tie that rule into a working possibility. Go read your own links yourself, because it is obvious that you haven’t.
It talks about limitations on hate speech, etc, but you can lie without hate speech.
Freedom of speech is an ideal, and is tied to state control of speech. There are all kinds of limitations, including public safety and defamation, etc. But if I called you a Martian, obviously that is a lie. What happens? Does the free speech police lock me up?
I’m not interested in personal attacks, by the way.
That’s true and I appreciate that different opinions are often unwelcome, I’d still rather that than end up in an extremely boring echo chamber where the “conversation” is not much more than a circle jerk.
Well if this person truly believes it wasn’t a Nazi salute, then he’s not lying.
I believe ghosts aren’t real, but that doesn’t mean I think anyone that has seen a ghost is lying, I truly believe that they think they saw a ghost.
There’s a huge difference between an objective truth and a widely agreed upon opinion.
It’s weird that this issue only comes up when it comes to defend nazi shit and not with other things. I’ll give you a specific example: I posted this on r/ShowerThoughts: “Incest is like pissing in your gene pool”. I think it’s pretty good, but mods deleted my post because it goes against community guidelines. If I got into an argument with the mods and got banned from r/ShowerThoughts, I wouldn’t be going around crying about “freedom of speech”, because it’s dumb, and communities have rules.
These arguments are always about normalizing nazi shit. Fuck that.
The difference here is that you made a post against community guidelines. Where as in this case the guy seems to have been banned for wrong think.
I’m not arguing that communities can’t have their own rules.
The difference here is that you made a post against community guidelines. Where as in this case the guy seems to have been banned for wrong think.
Man, it’s such a shitty hill to die on.
- When I posted, there was no specific guidance on “incest jokes” at r/Showerthoughts that I am aware of.
- Normalizing nazi shit goes against most communities guidelines, somewhere around the general, “don’t post hateful stuff” requirements
- If communities can have their own rules, they are free to ban people for hateful shit.
- And yeah, Musk made a nazi salute, which at this point is a pretty objective fact (Tesla’s track record of racial harassment, EM’s track record of boosting nazi shit on X, EM renaming self as Kekius Maximus, talking about the “future of our civilization” while doing the gesture, repetition, and turning as per nazi protocol, etc etc.). The only things that are up for debate are A) why did he do it? B) Was he chemically impaired while doing it.
Hear me out. Let’s remove the politics from this equation for a second
Let’s say I stood on a podium, did pelvic thrusts and formed a V with my fingers stuck my tongue through them making circular motions with it, and when people got upset, I responded to with pussy jokes. Would you interpret my actions as an “awkward gesture”? You could, but people would consider you either a perv, or a troll. Same applies here.
So yeah, stop normalizing nazi shit.
People here seem to be confused between me endorsing “Nazi shit”, which I am not, and me backing the freedom of speech.
I don’t know why this is such a hard concept to grasp.
Possibly defending Nazis was against community guidelines…? Pretty doublespeak of you to call one example “against guidelines” and the other “wrong think” and I’m sure I know why you do it.
We’re back to opinion Vs fact, again!
At the end of the day, until Musk comes out and says, “it was a Nazi salute and I’m a Nazi”, it will be up to opinion and everyone has a right to share their opinion.
and I’m sure I know why you do it.
I really don’t appreciate the insinuation but the least you could do is grow a pair, come out and say it.
Well if this person truly believes it wasn’t a Nazi salute, then he’s not lying
Agreed, that makes him deluded instead. Not many people however are stupid enough to be able to analyse Musk salute and belive it wasn’t a nazi one.
I’m not getting in to the Musk debate, I’m quite frankly bored of it, just let me know if he does it again.
I’m only here to defend freedom of speech.
I’m just here to defend freedom of speech.
Ensure you understand it first:
‘Freedom of speech is the right to seek, receive and impart information and ideas of all kinds, by any means.’
https://www.amnesty.org.uk/free-speech-freedom-expression-human-right
Thus my point that freedom of speech is not a freedom to lie or a freedom to spread hate or encourage violence (this is a general point, I am not referring to your views in particular).
Honestly, that’s very insulting and I don’t appreciate the insinuation. I know very well what the freedom of speech entails and I donate monthly to amnesty international.
I agree why I agree if you defend nazi then that is hate speech and he was rightly banned.
“Reddit continues to be anti-free speech,” Cedric Hohnstadt said on X. “I just got a lifetime ban from the ‘comics’ subreddit. Yesterday, I posted a humor comic that got over 5,400 upvotes. Then I noticed that there was a pinned post from the moderators saying that comics linked from X could no longer be shared because Musk gave a Nazi salute. I commented saying no he didn’t. The moderator accused me of being pro-Nazi, banned me permanently for life, and deleted all my past posts from the ‘comics’ subreddit. But somehow Elon Musk is the totalitarian?” The post has been viewed 3.7 million times.
Amazing that a blind man can draw comics.
It sucks to get banned for life from somewhere you love for doing something you didn’t feel was wrong, but holy hell, Musk absolutely threw up a Nazi salute.
The post has been viewed 3.7 million times.
Assuming this is the info box in new Reddit, those stats always felt… wrong
The difference between comments/votes and supposed “views” made it seem like the later was inflated.
Even more obvious was when something got posted at odd hours of the night in a local community. The view count would take off shortly after, while the comments and votes would only show up around when people wake up.
I think you severely underestimate the amount of people who just browse and don’t interact with stuff.
“Reddit continues to be anti-free speech,” Cedric Hohnstadt said on X.
Oh the twitter post
I didn’t notice where the quote ended
Could be partly explained by the language (and or cultural) barrier of the people from other parts of the world who view the post at night - when it’s daytime in their country.
By local community I meant one that’s specific to a small local area (ex. School, municipality). It’s possible that people from other parts of the world are seeing the post in the All type feeds, but I found it odd that only views went up while comments and votes didn’t until morning.
It makes sense for the cause to be bots, but that makes the number deceptive since it’s implying that your post reached a certain number of human viewers. It should be possible to adjust that number based on their estimates of humans vs. bots
Also, bots would likely inflate that number pretty drastically.
Truly inspiring
You can do anything. Except criticising musk. Thats too far.
SHUT THE FUCK UP YOU NAZI FUCK
Well said, if a little too understated even. In germany, some mention the nuremberg trials and nazis immediately shit their pants. Give it a read if you like.
wonder where the next trials will be held
Charlotte
Reddit’s about to get shittier. Again. Either they’ll kowtow to Musk and make it against the rules to ban X links or they’ll give some bland, noncommital, centrist statement about how they respect the hard work their mods put in to keep Reddit going or whatever. I really doubt they’ll make any unequivocal statement condemning Musk as the neo-Nazi shitbag he is.
The second reddit pulls some pro-Elon conservative bullshit, expect Lemmy to be FLOODED.
Reddit is a liberal haven and there will be a mass exodus if they toe the President Musk line.
hopefully not just lemmy.world cause
- terrible for lemmy
- terrible for them
If the API price-gouging scandal didn’t bring them all over already, then you might be surprised just how many continue to hang on there, even after this one. And the next one. And the next.
It’s just how people are. We don’t want to change.
It will bring some people over. But I doubt there will be a flood.
The API and pricing bullshit would have had 0 impact to people that (somehow manage to) us the Reddit app.
It affected power users, mods and technically proficient people.If communities have agreed to take a stance against musk/twitter/Nazis and Reddit overruled that, then I imagine an exodus of people that the API debacle didn’t affect.
But I don’t imagine it will be huge. Luckily, it will likely be decent people. So Reddit will slip more into a cesspool. And maybe more people will leave
I came over to Lemmy during the API pricing thing. I’ve never used a smartphone app (official or otherwise) to access Reddit. Just
old.reddit.comvia a browser on a clicky-typey computer. I quit Reddit out of solidarity. And because it was clear Reddit was getting shittier in every way.Same story for me. I never used the mobile apps or modded any community, I just don’t want to contribute to a site that’s hostile to the creators and users that made it successful in the first place. I imagine there are a lot of ordinary users like us that came here for the same reasons.
I hope he doesn’t. Most reddit users should just stay on reddit
Alternatively, nobody should stay on Reddit.
Why? I certainly would like to see more users here.
Honestly, I dont mind them making fedi instances. We have extremist instances barely anyone federates with, why not have the normies and liberalists have their own? They will probably go to threads anyway which we also defederated. I feel like every person (including musk, the orange and what other hitler wannabe comes next) should be on the fedi and be able to get fucking defederated by everyone. I feel like if that happened, we could finally move on from stateism to something more horizontal/federated but thats just a junior anarchists wet dream I guess.
With how active r/fednews has been, no surprise
Great timing for me to have deleted my account haha
Me too
Same as me, lol
