• @mannycalavera
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      1526 days ago

      Stop? Do you think it’s continuing? They already are private ☺️.

      What you should be saying is: Ask the government to raise billions to buy out private companies that own and operate the vital infrastructure of our country you maniacs!

      Not being funny, but this is what you’re calling for (nothing wrong with that) but what are you going to not fund whilst you spend money on this. Even Labour has pretty much said this isn’t going to happen for this very reason.

      • @RobotToaster@mander.xyz
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        2726 days ago

        Fine them a billion pounds per kilo of sewage dumped, then seize all their assets when they refuse to pay their debt.

        • @mannycalavera
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          25 days ago

          That’s actually not a bad idea. Although I would imagine passing regulation like this would be difficult, even with a change in government. 😔

        • @mannycalavera
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          225 days ago

          How else is the government going to nationalise the assets?

          • @ephemeral_gibbon@aussie.zone
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            525 days ago

            Fining the shit out of them for their many many environmental breaches. Then when they’re bankrupt, re-nationalise them for cheap.

        • streetlights
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          -426 days ago

          Our genius is not familiar with CPO’s. Or thinks CPO’s are communism. Let’s find out.

          • @mannycalavera
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            25 days ago

            No need for name calling. We’re all being civil here.

            CPOs as in, Compulsory Purchase Order? Do you think that applies here? Given that we’re talking about more than just the land, we’re talking about assets and running operations. Also … the land owner still needs to be paid. Where is that money going to come from?

            If there’s another CPO you’re taking about do let me know 👍.

              • @mannycalavera
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                625 days ago

                Not a genius, my friend. Just looking to have a civil conversation if you would drop the attitude please. There’s absolutely no need 👌.

      • @LordOfLocksley@lemmy.world
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        1325 days ago

        Nah, just get the government to send in the army to seize the assets and infrastructure. At this point in time, these companies are the enemy of the people, and what else is the army for, then to protect its people from enemies

      • @catch22@startrek.website
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        1126 days ago

        So essentially, what happened is billions (probably 100’s at this point) of public money have been handed to private individuals and everyone is left in the shit, literally.

      • streetlights
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        426 days ago

        They already are private ☺️.

        Except for viewers in Scotland.

        • Nimmo
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          125 days ago

          And Northern Ireland, but let’s be honest, Scotland has it’s own issues with nationalised bodies cough ferries cough so we Scots can’t sit here with too smug a grin on our faces. I’m sure Northern Ireland has it’s own issues in this field as well, but I don’t live there so I pay less attention to that.

          I broadly agree with nationalising critical infrastructure like water, electricity and gas, some other key infrastructure like railways, the post office and probably a few others I can’t think of at this moment in time but it’s far from perfect and isn’t going to make everything perfect overnight.

          • streetlights
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            425 days ago

            Dinnae get me started on those bastard ferries. Scandalous from head to toe.

            You’re absolutely right that nationalising something doesn’t automatically make it function. What it does fix however, is equity and profits being siphoned off and moved out of the country to foreign stakeholders for example.

            If private infrastructure fails, the public is still on the hook for it whether it’s privately owned or not.

      • Echo Dot
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        25 days ago

        People mean, don’t renew the contracts and also fine the ones that aren’t sticking to expectations.

        We won’t need to buy them out because the only reason this is an issue is because they are breaking agreements. Any that stick to agreements are by definition not a problem

      • @Blackmist
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        025 days ago

        You don’t need to buy them out. Fuck them. They can raise bills by inflation and not a penny more, and increase the water and sewage processing to match the extra people they need to over the years. No dumping sewage in rivers or the sea.

        If they can’t do it, then they go bust and you get them for nothing.

        All this shit was working when they took the services over, and if it’s not now, then it’s because they stole all the money that should have been used for upgrades.

  • @spacedogroy
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    5126 days ago

    Nationalise the lot of them. They had their chance.

    • Chaotic Entropy
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      425 days ago

      Their chance to do what…? This was always about handing them a gravy train.

    • @thr0w4w4y2@sh.itjust.works
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      -325 days ago

      would love to but where does the money come from to buy out all the shareholders? you would need to raise tens of billions - remember we just spent £10bn to give people a 1% tax cut

      and before you say “fuck the shareholders,” remember that lots of them are your pension fund

      • @IchNichtenLichten@lemmy.world
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        1125 days ago

        You pass legislation to make the company unprofitable by making it fulfill it’s obligation to invest in infrastructure to the point where the funds run for the hills.

            • @thr0w4w4y2@sh.itjust.works
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              125 days ago

              yes that would be awesome, but the problem is that “make it publicly owned” means “buy out their shares” which is giving them a bailout, plus “service all the debt the company is in” which is another bailout, before you’ve even got started with fixing the horrible lack of investment over many years

              • @IchNichtenLichten@lemmy.world
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                225 days ago

                but the problem is that “make it publicly owned” means “buy out their shares” which is giving them a bailout

                The shares would be almost worthless.

                plus “service all the debt the company is in” which is another bailout

                Nope, the company would be wound up.

      • GreatAlbatrossMA
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        25 days ago

        It shouldn’t be “lump it on the tax payers” or “we can’t do anything, because innocent pension holders may lose out”.
        It’s like the bad guy in the movie holding a hostage so they don’t get shot.

        The haircuts should be extracted from the people responsible: The funds that felt it was appropriate to include asset stripping of public utilities in general pension funds, and the executives they put in place/votes they cast at AGMs to make it happen.

        If that means that general pension funds fall, the holders should be going after the ones who mismanaged their pension, not the poor bastards having their water bills doubled, or having the cost of bailing out heaped on their government.

        • @thr0w4w4y2@sh.itjust.works
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          125 days ago

          I’d like it to go that way too but realistically, no government in the world is going to go after a massive hedge fund or investment bank for failing to stop a company asset stripping a public utility for profit.

  • @Zip2
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    3526 days ago

    Ofwat should only allow this on the provision that executives bonuses are removed, shareholders don’t receive any dividends for the next decade and the current heads of the water companies have to be dragged through a river every week.

    • GreatAlbatrossMA
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      2226 days ago

      I’ve previously advocated for the the first 1000L of any sewage runoff to be directed through executive’s houses.

      • @Zip2
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        926 days ago

        Now that is a nice idea, but I wouldn’t be surprised if that just forces them into their holiday homes abroad.

        Isn’t there a church somewhere that still has a ducking stool? I’ve had an idea. Wonder if they’ll rent it out.

        • GreatAlbatrossMA
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          1126 days ago

          If they leave the country, we can assign a man with a portable bucket of sewage.
          We will have no issues finding such a man: Most of Thames Water’s customers would pay for the privilege.

          • @Zip2
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            926 days ago

            As one of those people, I’m very happy to volunteer. Or maybe we make it compulsory like jury duty.

            • @SturgiesYrFase@lemmy.ml
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              626 days ago

              I currently live in Scotland, but I could do with a vacation to follow a rich cunt round with a bucket of sewage

    • @thr0w4w4y2@sh.itjust.works
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      625 days ago

      problem is then that shareholders will pull their money and invest elsewhere leaving the taxpayer to pick up the pieces. clever privatisations always leave the public purse to bail out any losses 😒

      the solution: don’t privatise in the first place. it’s like selling all your shit at a pawn shop

  • ᴇᴍᴘᴇʀᴏʀ 帝A
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    2925 days ago

    Water companies have been heavily criticised for widespread leaks and the amount of sewage being discharged, which critics have blamed on under-investment in the country’s infrastructure.

    Southern Water is owned by Australian firm Macquarie which has faced fierce criticism for the period when it was Thames Water’s biggest shareholder.

    In five of the 10 years it owned Thames, the company paid out more in dividends than it made in profits, while debt rose from £2.5bn to over £10bn in the same period.

    “Mum, I need money to repair my bike.”

    “We gave you money to repair your bike.”

    “Oh I spent it on sweets for me and my mates.”

  • @steeznson@lemmy.world
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    2825 days ago

    If it was a real private market they’d let the firm fail and the investors would take a haircut. Then either someone who could turn a profit while running a decent/affordable service would take over; or the govt would.

    We’re stuck in the worst of both worlds where it’s a privatised monopoly which is unable to fail.

      • @ThePyroPython@lemmy.world
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        225 days ago

        Then goodbye every UK resident’s pension that are invested in the water companies.

        That’s why they’re “too big to fail”. You let them fail, you’ll throw people who are about 40 to 50 years old into further reliance on the state pension.

        Better to prosecute the C-level executives and take the company back into public ownership.

        • GreatAlbatrossMA
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          725 days ago

          I’ve pondered on this a bit.
          Maybe the funds that thought it was appropriate to put for-profit public utilities in a pension fund should be the responsible parties, along with the water company executives they put in position to facilitate the asset stripping.

          • @ThePyroPython@lemmy.world
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            325 days ago

            That’s something I’d like to see. Never going to happen in the UK.

            In the 2008 financial crisis, I think Iceland was the only country to jail their irresponsible bankers.

        • Echo Dot
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          25 days ago

          A proper pension is diversified. They don’t invest entirely in one sector of business.

          Unless you’ll managing your own pension in which case that’s your fault.

            • Echo Dot
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              Out of interest I actually have just looked at how my pension is diversified and almost all of it is incredibly diversified. A lot I’d it is in pharmaceutical companies, and technology companies, but there’s even investors in a company that makes things like electric fences and barbed wire, I guess because the barbed wire industry is not going to crash anytime soon.

              If we are invested in water companies I can’t find them, so they mustn’t be a very significant percentage. And anyway why would they be? This scandal has been going on for so long that any pension management companies would have long since sold.

  • HexesofVexes
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    2025 days ago

    Here’s a fun thought - push a law through demanding a minimal level of service with forced nationalisation at the cost of the shareholders if it isn’t met (government pays share price, but proceeds go towards settling company debt first rather than being paid out to shareholders).

    Give them a way to fail that doesn’t hurt the people who rely on the services, and punish running up unsustainable debt in one joyous law.

  • GreatAlbatrossMA
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    1826 days ago

    Water firms can get in the fucking sea.

  • Destide
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    1125 days ago

    Privatise profit socialise loss

  • Rayquetzalcoatl
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    1025 days ago

    Ah good, so my bill will rise and then my landlord will up the rents to cover whatever water shit she has to pay too. Brill. Love this Cuntry.

      • Echo Dot
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        425 days ago

        I have a house and for some reason they still make me pay water bills. Madness.

        Also now the poor quality décor is my fault. I’m not into it.

  • applepie
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    526 days ago

    Up next the air and the Sun… peasant you gonna pay for fucking shitting here soon too… per each use 😜

    Final stage: you pay some money changer for the right to sleep with your wife!

  • Echo Dot
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    325 days ago

    How do you go bankrupt selling a life essential that falls out of the sky for free?

  • Norgur
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    326 days ago

    Just out of curiosity: the article states finite amounts to pay each year. Do you Brits pay one sub or do you pay for consumption (eg per Liter)?

    • @icerunner_origin@startrek.website
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      726 days ago

      Both. Some households, usually in older buildings, pay ‘water rates’ based on the size of their property. Others, including all newly built homes, have water meters which report usage back to the company. We pay for supply of clean water as well as transportation and processing of surface water run-off and sewage.

        • Nimmo
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          225 days ago

          That’s not quite true, water charges are part of your council tax. You get a discount if you have a septic tank because then dealing with the waste water is your responsibility.

          But you pay a flat rate based on your property’s estimated value in 1991.

          • @EinfachUnersetzlich@lemm.ee
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            124 days ago

            In Scotland perhaps. There’s no council tax in Northern Ireland either, instead they use the rates system. I’m not aware that there are any discounts for septic tank users.